On the Non Existance of Christianity

[bardiphouka]

First of all, I am not saying there was or was not a person/divinity named Jesus of Nazareth. It is not the cause but the effect I am speaking of. So atheists may be disappointed. Of course the illogic of Atheism with a capital A as a belief system is a different story altogether.


But..back to Christianity as a dream that never was. As an example, let us take Bob and Ted and Carol and Alice. Bob is a Roman Catholic, Ted is a Methodist, Carol is a JW and Alice belongs to one of those snake handling beliefs. All four of them would say that they are Christian. But what exactly do they have in common? Nothing really. Such it is such as it has always been..dating back to the beginning and the argument between the Paulists and the Petrists.

The question arises, but cannot one be a Christian without belonging to a denomination? Not really, for two reasons. One being that we all tend to keep what we are raised with. There is a fine book out there called Once a Catholic in which this argument is raised over and over again but people who consider themselves ex Catholics but realise the Church is still inside them. And I am assuming that the same would be true in other faiths, although perhaps not always to the same extent?

And the other is that if one attempts to follow the precepts of the winners of the Paulist/Petrists debate then the answer is no. Paul tells us that God exists where people gather together to worship. Of course I am probably just as guilt of cafeteria theology as anyone else, so who am I to blame anyone.

Comments

[kellingham.livejournal.com]

we all tend to keep what we are raised with

What of those of us who are raised with an official denomination that goes on forms, but with no actual involvement in in and form of religion (beyond what we're forcefed in school anyway)?

[bardiphouka.livejournal.com]

then that is what you keep? Do you consider yourself involved in a religion (state supported or not) now?

[kellingham.livejournal.com]

I don't seem to be?

[laviniaspeaks.livejournal.com]

Do you really think that you can't be "christian" without a denomination? Or is it only that we cannot be the common label of Christian without one? That we can be worshippers of God and Christ without a denomination but cannot call and label ourselves ("ourselves" being a general thing) Christian without the crutch of a denomination?

And what denomination is a church that calls itself just a Christian church? For example, the church I attend here in Indy is called "Common Ground Christian Church." So what denomination is it? I mean, it doesn't actually label itself as "Non-denominational"...so...?

Anyway. I'm not one to talk--I was raised Episcopalian, and still find myself haunted by the litergy, by the rites, and by the seasons...even though I prefer the manner of my church here in Indy.

[bardiphouka.livejournal.com]

denomination, sic.."A large group of religious congregations united under a common faith and name and organized under a single administrative and legal hierarchy." So, I would think yes you could be. What I meant was that an argument could be made that one cannot be 'christian' without belonging to some sort of community of faith.

As for churches that call themselves 'just'a Christian church. to be honest I am not sure I can be objective..it does seem to me to smack a bit of hubris? Common Ground? obviously I doubt that I,as a Roman Catholic and believer in Dual Covenant would have much common ground with them. But I have to be honest and say that this is an issue with me as a person.

[laviniaspeaks.livejournal.com]

Ah, but see the "common ground" referred to is Christ and the worship of Christ, not the worship of the doctrines of man... And, while I may not be Catholic, and thus do not adhere to nor, truly, understand adhereing to those doctrines, the ones I was raised with via Canturbury and the whole Anglican Church thing are ones I, personally have forsaken... I cannot, in good faith (pun not intended), follow or worship the doctrines of man...

Thus I cannot see it as hubris. Just as statement: that here we meet to discuss that which unites us: Christ. Not that we all hold common ground in doctrines, etc. (although I can tell you that this is one of the few "christian" churches I've gone to that also celebrates, once a month, a litergical service), but that these doctrines are of man and thus are not our primary goal in worship and in the living of our lives.

But perhaps I have driven us a bit off the trail. I realise that Roman Catholics come from it with a very, very different perspective from most Christian sects...every person on my street who had a hand in raising me was Roman Catholic...and have all spent many years pointing out to me the differences and importance of doctrine...

Now I'm rambling. My apologies.

[laviniaspeaks.livejournal.com]

and by mentioning "doctrines of man" I do not mean to start a debate on the writing of the bible vs. fundamental reading of God's word, etc... =) Just referring to the catechisms of different Christian sects.

[bardiphouka.livejournal.com]

Aww..and I do love a good debate=). But see, you sort of make my point..in that the Catholic Churches and the Protestant and the neo-protestant all make the same claim, that they are Christian..even though there are some substantial differences. The bottom line for me is that it helps fulfill the individual?

[tonyhippy.livejournal.com]

Atheism as a belief system? Dunno about that! I'm an atheist because I simply do not believe there is a god. That's really all it takes to be an atheist (it only needs a capital letter if it starts the sentence).

[bardiphouka.livejournal.com]

atheists do not believe in a supreme deity. Atheists believe that nobody else should either. There is a difference.